Roberto Germán [00:00:01]:
Welcome to Our Classroom. In this space, we talk about education, which is inclusive of but not limited to what happens in schools. Education is taking place whenever and wherever we are willing to learn. I am your host, Roberto Germán, and our classroom is officially in session. My people, welcome back to Our Classroom. It’s our pleasure to have brother Kwame Sarfo-Mensah once again. He’s not new to the platform. If you know, you know.
Roberto Germán [00:00:38]:
This is the math specialist. This is the CEO of Identity Talk, consultant, Mr. Sierra Leone. That’s where he’s posted up right now. So the fact that we’re able to get him on, man, like, it’s a big deal, people, major sacrifice to be able to make this happen in terms of the time difference or whatnot. And Kwame always has a lot going on, including his writing, which is good, which is impactful. And he has a new book on the horizon, likely in November, so stay tuned for that. We’re gonna unpack a little bit about the book here today.
Roberto Germán [00:01:16]:
Kwame, welcome back to our classroom.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:01:19]:
Hey, man. Hombre. What’s going on, man?
Roberto Germán [00:01:23]:
I’m just here. I’m here trying to relearn. I’m learning to relearn. My man.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:01:28]:
Oh. Oh, my God. My guy. It’s always good to be back in our classroom. You already know how much love I got for you and Lorena and what y’all do, so it’s always fam, you know what I mean?
Roberto Germán [00:01:43]:
Hey, the love is mutual, man. You’re one of the few platforms that I see out there, few individuals that I see out there just consistently opening up a space for people to come and share their expertise, share their writings, share their insight. And so I love what you’re doing with Identity Talk. You’re certainly an inspiration for us and appreciate your grind.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:02:09]:
Likewise, man. The feeling’s mutual.
Roberto Germán [00:02:12]:
Well, you have a new book coming out, and certainly last time we were on, we were talking about math and all types of math-related questions and conversations that were affirming me as a math learner. But this is going to be a different type of affirmation because your book, the one on the horizon, is Learning to Relearn: Supporting Identity in a Culturally Affirming Classroom. Excited about that for you. I’m sure you’re excited. And your book discusses the concept of schooling versus education. I love it because that’s something I think about, talk about, and I think about the T-shirts and what brother Babu Blake puts out where he’s always talking about school versus education. And so I’d love for you to elaborate on the difference and why it’s crucial for educators to focus on educating rather than merely schooling.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:03:15]:
So first off, thank you for that question because it’s an important one. And when you think about schooling, in a nutshell, schooling is all about how well you can comply with protocols, rules, and different guidelines that are set by the school organization or entity that you’re in. So in the case of K-12, for those who have gone through it, like you and I, you know that every school year you have a new teacher. Usually, you start off the first week with a set of rules that the teacher tells you to follow. And usually, there’s no input from the students. These are rules that are set from the beginning before you even step foot in the classroom door.
Roberto Germán [00:04:08]:
Right. So these are not classroom norms that we’ve created as a community.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:04:13]:
No, that’s not co-created at all. These are things that the teacher has already set in her mind and has decided this is how the classroom should function regardless of who steps into that space. Now, as you go through K-12 and you get into college and we went to college and we know how that is, schooling goes to another level. It’s not so much about how smart you are; it’s really about how well you can comply.
Roberto Germán [00:04:53]:
So you got to be a master of compliance.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:04:56]:
Master of compliance in order for you to achieve. Perfect example. You go into a class, professor gives you the syllabus. Usually, there is a breakdown of how you’re going to be graded for this class. And let’s say that 20% is participation. So in your mind, you’re thinking, all right, 20%. So that means every single time a question is asked by the professor, I got to raise my hand to let them know that I am engaged. Even though we know as educators that’s not the only way engagement is manifested.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:05:38]:
You could be the quietest person and still be engaged.
Roberto Germán [00:05:41]:
True.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:05:42]:
You know what I mean. But at the time, as an 18, 19-year-old, that was my thought process. If I can answer enough questions from the professor, if I can contribute a whole lot during class, at least a few times every class, that’s going to get me up to that 20%. And then on top of that, if I go to the professor’s office hours, that’s going to let the professor know that I’m even more invested in the class than the average student. So this is the thought process I’m having. None of this has anything to do with academic prowess or anything like that. This is about, well, how do I manipulate the system in order to get what I need, right?
Roberto Germán [00:06:32]:
You know, I got a song that comes to mind for this. “Politics as Usual.”
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:06:41]:
Jay-Z, of course.
Roberto Germán [00:06:43]:
Yeah, you know, you politic to navigate the system like that’s what it is. Hey, I’m gonna tip the professor’s bias in my favor.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:06:52]:
And, yeah, and when I think about my own journey. I graduated from Temple University two times, so I’m proud of that. But I’ll also be honest when I say I didn’t graduate because I was the smartest guy. I was a math major all throughout my years there, and my final GPA was a 2.3 in my major. But because I worked hard and I took advantage of the office hours because I had good relationships with all my professors, and I went to the tutoring center every week to get help with certain problems I had in math. That’s, well, that’s why I was able to get by.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:07:37]:
And there were certain classes that should have failed, but because the professor curved the grade, that was my safety valve. That was my saving grace. So schooling is something that presents itself in different ways. And we even think about legacies, right? Legacies who go to college and are able to get in without having the most stellar academic record. That’s because they have daddies or mothers who are trustees of the university, so they’re able to talk to whoever, and they get in that way. But schooling is something that we’ve all been victims of in some shape or form, Whether it’s you walk in a straight line, you sitting in a row in the classroom, cell phone use, making sure your cell phones are put away. That’s always a big conversation. Uniform policies, zero-tolerance policies.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:08:54]:
There are so many examples. There’s so much time focusing on those things and not enough time actually teaching students about things that are relevant to their lives, things that they need in order to be the best version of themselves.
The transcript continues with the back-and-forth dialogue, edited to enhance readability while preserving original expressions and timing. Would you like the full transcript as a downloadable document?
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:08:54]:
There are so many examples. There’s so much time spent focusing on those things and not enough time actually teaching students about things that are relevant to their lives, things that they need to become the best version of themselves.
Roberto Germán [00:09:11]:
And we’re seeing some shifts. We’re seeing some shifts where, for sure, many young people are not going the traditional route because they’ve concluded, like, one, it costs way too much money. So I’m gonna be, you know, in debt for how long? For a career that I’m gonna make how much money? But you also have folks who are starting to understand, like, wait, I can continue to educate myself through these alternative means. However we define that, right? Whether it’s through YouTube and Google, courses, and certifications. There are major corporations now offering opportunities where, if you pursue certifications in the ways they lay out for you to get there…
Roberto Germán [00:10:05]:
That’s not the traditional college route, but it will suffice as opposed to a four-year degree. And listen, I’m not discouraging anybody from going the traditional route. Obviously, we did that.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:10:17]:
Yes.
Roberto Germán [00:10:18]:
But I think folks have to be very discerning about their aims and the best way to get there. Especially because higher ed, in many ways—I hate to say this, but in many ways, it feels like a hustle. And I’m not pulling this out of thin air. You know, I worked in high schools, I worked with young people. And part of my job in a couple of stops I was at was supporting them in identifying the right fit in terms of higher ed as they moved on from high school. And we would always get to that point where it’s like, listen, I know you want to go to XYZ University, but that’s gonna put you in debt for the rest of your life. Why don’t you consider going to a state school? For some of my kids, it was like, why don’t you do community college for two years, stack your credits, and then go to a four-year school? The first two years, you’re doing all the same basic courses anyway. Save yourself some money, right? We would have these conversations, and I’m talking about like, you know, a decade ago, never mind how much it costs now.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:11:28]:
Oh my.
Roberto Germán [00:11:29]:
So again, nobody’s discouraging our young people from pursuing a four-year, traditional route. If that’s your road, take it by all means. For some people, it has to be that because there’s a specific career path that they’re on. But that’s not for everybody. And more importantly, as we’re talking about here, you know, have an understanding about the difference between education and school. And we want people to fall in love with being educated.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:12:02]:
Right?
Roberto Germán [00:12:02]:
We want people to fall in love with learning. And I feel like that’s part of what you’re getting at with your book, you know, saying we need to relearn, like shake things up so that you don’t think, oh, this is the only way—the way you hated. I’m not saying everybody hated the way the education system played out; for plenty of people, it worked out, they loved it. Wonderful. If that was you, hey, God bless you. I can’t say that was necessarily my experience. Even though there were moments, there were periods of times where, like, yeah, I had the right teacher, right fit. But in terms of, like, the overall experience?
Roberto Germán [00:12:39]:
No, no. I think things could have been done much differently. And it makes me think about, you know, the passion for teaching and the moments in which I felt my passion was waning a bit. And I know that you got at that in your book, where you talk about, you know, teaching started out—this is a quote from your book—“Teaching started out as an addictive passion but over time became a job that I dreaded doing.” Ooh.
Roberto Germán [00:13:10]:
I think some people… I think some people can relate. I think some people… Can you build on that?
Let me know if you’d like me to continue in this format or make further adjustments.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:13:16]:
Sure. And my story is not unique among educators, so when I talk about the addictive passion, I’m talking about the romanticization of teaching. Think about when we were growing up, Roberto. We had those teachers who would stay in schools for 25, 30 years and teach multiple generations of families. And this was before No Child Left Behind, so they didn’t have to worry about the pressures of students performing on state tests, even though state tests existed back in the day. In my case, 90s, late 80s, you know.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:14:02]:
So when I first became an educator in the early 2010s, I thought that I was going to be that teacher. I wanted to be the one who was going to be a mainstay at one school for multiple years, teaching generations of families and building a legacy that way. And that’s how I approached the job in the beginning. I was naive; I was caught by the savior complex bug a little bit. I’ll acknowledge that, because I felt like I had a chance to really make a tremendous impact on young people.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:14:47]:
And I saw colleagues who were sacrificing time, time away from their families, time away from their loved ones, time away from their friends to do this work. So I assumed that that was how I was supposed to operate. I thought that was the norm. So I decided to adopt these toxic, unhealthy behaviors. And as a result of doing that, I started to see the ugly side of what it means to be a Black educator and what it means to be invisibly taxed because I was a Black educator. So I saw what that was, and I ended up losing my job after my first year of teaching because of politics. And I’ve shared this on other platforms, but I’ll just share the abridged version.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:15:49]:
So basically, I was at a charter school in Philadelphia, a very prestigious charter school, and I didn’t have an instructional coach the entire year. I didn’t have any evaluations. I didn’t have any observations the entire year. It wasn’t until April, after we had done our state testing, that I got my very first of any of those. And it was…
Roberto Germán [00:16:18]:
That happened to me. That happened to me also. Go ahead.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:16:21]:
Yo, bro. It was done by a board member who was a retired principal, had never visited my classroom before, had no context of who I was beyond my name and who my kids were. She just popped in one day, sat in the corner of the room for about 30 minutes, and was taking low-inference notes while I was doing my thing with students. Now, mind you, it’s April. We had gone all this time preparing for this state test. The state test is over. We’re trying to, yeah, yeah, like, it’s over.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:17:01]:
The state test is the Super Bowl. So these kids are not as focused as they would be if it was, let’s say, October, November, and we were still on that grind. So that’s when she came into my room. And it wasn’t a case where kids were misbehaving. I mean, the kids were fine. We were doing some light work, but nothing super rigorous. But from that one observation came a failed evaluation, which then got to my principal’s lap. And it was around this time where I had signed a contract to come back for another year.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:17:44]:
So this is April. Now fast forward to June, a week into the summer vacation. I get a call from my principal. Now I’m back in Connecticut visiting family. He’s calling me from Connecticut. He’s calling me while I’m there saying, “Hey, are you able to come back to Philly? Because I gotta talk to you. We gotta meet.”
Roberto Germán [00:18:04]:
Come on, man.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:18:05]:
So I end up cutting my vacation short to go to this meeting in Philly. I go to my principal’s office, and he slides the pink slip and says, “Hey, man, we unfortunately have to rescind your contract and let you go.” And I’m like, really? How? I just told you. I went a whole year without any observations, nothing. No negative reports from parents. My colleagues were raving about me. The principal who fired me was raving about me.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:18:48]:
And I’m asking him, yo, why? And he was like, “Well, the board said we have to let you go. Sorry, it wasn’t my decision.” So basically, I was a scapegoat because it was either going to be him or it was going to be me, at least that’s how I saw it. Because he knew he messed up. He couldn’t even look me in the eye.
Roberto Germán [00:19:13]:
Wow.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:19:14]:
He couldn’t look me in the eye. And, man, to have to experience that as a first-year teacher was devastating. So the addictive passion comes from what I mentioned in the beginning—how we romanticize being a teacher. All the beauty that comes with it, decorating the room and, you know, all the stuff that you see on like, you know…
Roberto Germán [00:19:42]:
All those Pinterest…
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:19:44]:
Pinterest. The Pinterest pages. But then fast forward to year nine. Now I’m in Boston. I’m a Boston Public Schools teacher now, teaching 7th and 8th-grade math. I’m at a school that’s a pretty decent school. My colleagues are super dope, but I had a principal who just wasn’t engaged with the students the way I felt she should be. And I just felt like if you are a really strong teacher and you’re somebody who vocalizes issues and injustices that are happening—not just to students but even to other colleagues—you end up getting into more trouble than someone who just shuts their mouth and keeps it moving.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:20:39]:
So I ended up being that person near the tail end of my time at my school. And it caused me to bump heads with my principal. And I also saw that there were colleagues who just weren’t as invested in this work as I was. Because my naive self thought, well, shoot, if we’re all teachers, we should all be believing in the same things and the same morals and principles. But I found out that some just want to come in and leave as soon as the kids leave. Not to say that you shouldn’t do that from time to time; you definitely have to for your mental health. You shouldn’t be staying late every day.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:21:27]:
But there were some who never, ever stayed behind. Or you could tell they were just going through the motions.
Roberto Germán [00:21:39]:
Right?
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:21:39]:
It was just a job to them, regardless of what was going on with the kids. You know what I mean? It’s just a job. And it was more than that for me. And I wanted people to have the same passion as I did. But you realize that not everybody is on that tip. And that used to frustrate me. And sometimes I acknowledge that the way my frustration would come out would manifest in ways that probably weren’t the best approach, as I reflect.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:22:09]:
But I was at that stage where I knew this was not working. And thankfully, my wife got a job offer to work with the Peace Corps, which meant that I could resign from my job and move abroad, which is where I’ve been for the past five years.
Roberto Germán [00:22:33]:
Man, man, man. Yeah, those types of situations can definitely take the life and enthusiasm out of educators. Please let me know if you’d like to proceed in this way, continue with further edits, or make any additional adjustments.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:22:45]:
Yes.
Roberto Germán [00:22:46]:
And it’s unfortunate because we end up losing a lot of good folks along the way. And sometimes there are people who are doing this work and are so invested in the children and in pushing things forward, but they feel alone. Right. You feel like you’re on an island. And it makes me think about the notion of allyship and co-conspiratorship, which you talk about in your book.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:23:17]:
Yes, yes.
Roberto Germán [00:23:18]:
Can you explain what this transition involves and why it’s essential for meaningful change? Because I think when we’re in spaces where we are able to identify co-conspirators, it can inspire us to sustain our efforts in a particular place and with a particular initiative. So, yeah, yeah. Can you expound on that?
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:23:49]:
So when I look at allyship and co-conspirator roles, I think there are some folks who have a tendency to interchange these terms. Even though there is a lot of intersection between them, they’re not exactly the same. And here’s what I mean by that. So when I think about allyship, and this is my interpretation of it, allyship is when you have a colleague in your school who empathizes with what it is to be a person of color. They empathize with you; they see that there are issues you’re dealing with as a result of your racial or cultural background.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:24:36]:
They’re like, “Yes, I feel you. I’m with you.” They may wear a shirt that represents certain causes, like a Black Lives Matter shirt, or they might have a pride flag shirt, or a sign on their classroom door that says, “Everyone is welcome,” to show their support.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:25:02]:
But that’s their ceiling. It doesn’t go beyond that. Now, when I talk about a co-conspirator, I’m talking about somebody who not only does those things but now takes it a step further. They’re going to go to city hall with you to speak up. They’ll sign a petition on your behalf to bring light to an injustice that’s taking place. They’ll be a part of a committee focused on anti-bias or anti-racist issues. They’re doing more than the minimum.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:25:51]:
So when I look at what allyship has become in many cases over the past five years, we’ve had a whole bunch of folks buy books, listen to podcasts—there’s all this intellectual property out there for folks to access and learn about the isms and everything that goes on in this country. And what’s amazing to me is that there are people who still expect you to give them more than what’s already out there. Resources are everywhere. For example, someone can buy a copy of Textured Teaching, do a whole book club on it, and have rich discussions breaking down all the different terms in the book.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:27:00]:
And it’s an incredible book; I have a copy myself. I know it’s incredible.
Roberto Germán [00:27:04]:
Shout out to Lorena, shout out to Lorena.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:27:07]:
But it stops there. Okay, you’ve read the book. You’ve gained some new knowledge. Now, how do you make that actionable? How do you apply that in your practice? How does that apply in your context as an educator? What’s going to be your role in transformation? See, that’s where the co-conspirator comes in. When we talk about co-conspirators, when we talk about abolitionists, they’re the ones who are like, yeah, we’re gonna read this book, but guess what? We’re going to stand on business as well. We’re going to be at the marches. We’re going to call these legislators.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:27:58]:
We’re going to make sure that people are voting not just in the federal but also in local elections—the city council meetings, your state senators. We’re doing the whole gamut. And I think that’s the part people need to understand. There’s another level to participation. There’s another level that’s required at this stage, especially looking at this current presidential election. It’s not enough for us to intellectualize and just read the books. That was okay in 2020 after George Floyd. Now you gotta do something more.
Roberto Germán [00:28:45]:
You gotta do something more.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:28:48]:
We gotta do more now. We gotta start holding people accountable for what they say and their actions.
Roberto Germán [00:28:57]:
Yeah, that’s real talk. Accountability is essential. Application, right? Application. We’re not just consuming for the sake of consuming. We’re consuming because we want to see change. We want to see transformation.
Roberto Germán [00:29:16]:
As a matter of fact, you talk about transformation as it relates to what we want to see from our students, what we want to see in this world. And you assert that the purpose of Learning to Relearn is to support educators in becoming individuals who challenge their students to discover how to participate in the transformation of the world.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:29:42]:
That’s right.
Roberto Germán [00:29:43]:
What are some practical steps that teachers can take to guide their students in the transformative process?
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:29:51]:
Well, before students can partake in transforming the world, they’ve got to know who they are. That’s the whole purpose of this book: to help students build a positive self-image of who they are. That’s why it’s culturally affirming. We’re affirming culture, and we’re also affirming a whole bunch of other identity markers as well. There’s a lot of talk about intersectionality, and critical race theory is also an influence throughout the book.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:30:29]:
I’m sorry, right-wingers and conservatives. I’m going to talk about it.
Roberto Germán [00:30:32]:
You trying to get banned?
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:30:34]:
You know what I’m saying? That’d be a badge of honor. But anyway, it’s really about that. Right. So, if you were a student, I would want you to feel good about being Dominican. I’d want you to learn about the history of your country and the people who played a role in liberation. You know what I’m saying? I’d want you to know about that because that’s what’s going to allow you to feel better about who you are. And when you think about the whitewashing that happens within our school curriculum, when you think about the book bans that are taking place, the rampant censoring of anti-bias and anti-racist curriculum, anti-LGBTQ+ legislation, I can go on and on. All these things contribute to identity-based harm.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:31:53]:
They contribute to identity-based harm. And when your identity is harmed, you develop a negative self-image. And if you have a negative self-image and you’re not learning about the full history—not just the struggles but also the moments where your people thrived, and within that history are lessons still applicable today to help us achieve liberation—then how are you going to be able to be a transformer of this world? If you don’t feel good about yourself, if you don’t have any concept of home, whatever home is for you, then it’s hard. That’s what this book is about, man. It’s really about getting teachers to understand the importance of identity affirmation and how it has to be connected to social-emotional learning and to all the other aspects of the instructional day. The more we can get educators to understand that concept, the more we’ll see students thriving and becoming the transformative people we need them to be in this current world.
Roberto Germán [00:33:26]:
Yeah. And certainly, for our youngsters, especially once they hit middle school, that search for identity is so present in their lives, in their minds. As a former middle school principal, I definitely saw it play out in a number of different ways in terms of how they experienced the school environment and how they navigated the world. And, yeah, part of our duty is to support them along their journey, right? To give them space, give them the room to engage with different content, learn new concepts, and learn about new people. Present history in a way that feeds their curiosity and isn’t just directed at them, right?
Roberto Germán [00:34:24]:
Hence what we were talking about earlier in regard to schooling versus education.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:34:49]:
That’s right.
Roberto Germán [00:34:51]:
Yeah. Thank you for that. I’m really anticipating what I can pick up that’s new from your book, what strategies I could apply to my own craft, and what strategies I can share with other teachers that I’m leading. As we conclude here, you know the drill.
Roberto Germán [00:35:20]:
If you had an opportunity to have lunch with anybody, dead or alive, who would it be and why?
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:35:27]:
I don’t remember who I said last time.
Roberto Germán [00:35:30]:
Well, let’s see, let’s see.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:35:31]:
If I’m gonna repeat, we’ll see. I didn’t watch that last episode. Let me see. Who do I want to have dinner with and why? There are so many people, man. Only one? Okay, I’m going to go ahead and say Yolanda Sealey-Ruiz. Dr. Yolanda Sealey-Ruiz.
Roberto Germán [00:35:57]:
Dr. Ruiz. Yes, Sealey-Ruiz. That’s a good one. That’s a good one.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:36:02]:
So she is the foreword writer for this book. She’s someone whose work in identity has caused major shifts in my thinking as it pertains to what it means to be an educator, a culturally responsive educator. And whenever you hear her speak, and you witness her speaking, it’s always love, man. Like, I could sit here and listen to her all day. She just has the most loving and most magnetic presence about her—it’s captivating. And whenever we connect, it doesn’t matter how many months go by, she’ll be like, “Brother, you know I love you.” And she really means that. When I first had the idea for this book, I had her on my podcast about three years ago. This was after we finished recording, and we had spent a whole 90 minutes going over her book, Love from the Vortex, which is a book that y’all need to get—lots of great poetry in there.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:37:29]:
I said, “Hey, sis, like, I got this book that I’m thinking about, and I would be honored if you could be my foreword writer.” And she barely knew who I was, but at that moment, she was like, “Yo, I got you, brother. I got you.” And the fact that she had so much faith in me at a time when I was still trying to figure out what this book would eventually become meant the world, man. Those are the kind of people I try to surround myself with—people like yourself, like Lorena, and many others who are about this work and understand the importance of community and how it plays a role in ensuring that we go hard in this pursuit of liberation and justice. We can’t do this alone.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:38:20]:
There are times when we’re not feeling ourselves; there are times when we’re just not up for it. But guess what? There’s someone there who’s going to pick you right back up. And Yolanda is that person for me. So if I had a chance to have dinner with anybody, I would say her. So that’s my answer.
Roberto Germán [00:38:40]:
Great pick. Shout out to Dr. Yolanda Sealey-Ruiz. Doing amazing work and someone we can all learn from for sure.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:38:51]:
Yes, sir.
Roberto Germán [00:38:52]:
What’s your message of encouragement to the audience?
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:38:56]:
Message of encouragement? I would say, just take it one day at a time. There are so many issues going on around our world, and we want to try to fix them right away. But most of these issues are marathon problems. So in understanding that, you have to do a little bit each day, one brick at a time, one day at a time, and you’ll eventually get there. That’s what I had to do for this book. Man, there were days where I was ready to quit, bro.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:39:45]:
It took me three years to write this book.
Roberto Germán [00:39:47]:
Wow.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:39:48]:
Three years with multiple revisions, multiple peer editors. I mean, y’all were part of that peer editing process.
Roberto Germán [00:40:02]:
That’s right.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:40:03]:
I appreciate the feedback that y’all gave because it forced me to do more research, which was helpful for the Latinx Perspectives chapter, which I’m very proud of. We got some incredible stories in that chapter, where we talk about a lot of things. But I would just say to folks, man, one day at a time, give yourself grace. And give yourself grace, too, because some days you’re just not going to have it. That doesn’t mean you’re a horrible person.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:40:36]:
It just means that the next day will be different. Turn the page.
Roberto Germán [00:40:42]:
That’s right. That’s right. Listen, my people, the book is coming out probably around November. Stay tuned. Learning to Relearn: Supporting Identity in a Culturally Affirming Classroom. Brother Kwame Sarfo-Mensah, an amazing educator making an impact all over the place. Hey, if y’all don’t know, if y’all don’t follow him, you better tune into Identity Talk with Brother Kwame—always has amazing guests.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:41:15]:
Yes.
Roberto Germán [00:41:15]:
Great topics, great content to support your professional development. And he’s also published other books. So where can folks follow you if they want to connect with you personally or learn more about your work? Where can they follow you?
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:41:35]:
Many places, but I think the easiest place to find me is at my website, identitytalk4educators.com. So that’s the number “4” in the URL. You’ll find all my social media connections there. As far as social media platforms, I’d say Instagram, LinkedIn, and Twitter/X. Definitely hit me up there. And if you want to get a sneak peek at what to expect from this book, we have a website that’s accessible right now. It has the chapter titles, exclusive resources for you to access right now. You can check it out at learningtorelearn.com. So if you go there, there’s a link to buy a copy of the book. But if you’re still wondering what this Learning to Relearn book is about, scroll through the website, and you’ll get to see each chapter’s title, different book recommendations.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:42:45]:
I have podcast recommendations, as well as some activities you can do with your students, especially during the first month of the school year that’s coming up.
Roberto Germán [00:42:59]:
There you have it, folks. No excuses. Go do what you got to do right now. Support and follow Brother Kwame. Hey, thanks for being here. Always a pleasure to connect with you, man. You know you got love from us here at Multicultural Classroom, man.
Roberto Germán [00:43:13]:
We will continue to be behind you in the work that you’re doing, man. Thank you, Kwame. Thank you for being who you are.
Kwame Sarfo-Mensah [00:43:20]:
My pleasure. Same words I could share with y’all, man. Y’all inspire a lot of people, especially as a married couple—the way y’all work together, the way y’all support each other. Y’all are providing a blueprint for a lot of people, man. So just know…
Roberto Germán [00:43:37]:
We appreciate that. Peace and blessings, as always. Your engagement in our classroom is greatly appreciated. Be sure to subscribe, rate the show, and write a review. Finally, for resources to help you understand the intersection of race, bias, education, and society, go to multiculturalclassroom.com. Peace and love from your host, Roberto Germán.
