Roberto Germán [00:00:01]:
Welcome to Our Classroom. In this space, we talk about education, which is inclusive of, but not limited to, what happens in schools. Education is taking place whenever and wherever we are willing to learn. I am your host, Roberto Germán, and Our Classroom is officially in session. Hey, folks. Welcome back to Our Classroom here with a special guest, Bea Jackson, who is the illustrator of many books, including summer is here. Listen, I don't know if y'all check this out or not. I'm sure many of you have written by Renée Watson, and Renée was supposed to join us, but unfortunately, our schedule's been in line for this particular interview.
Roberto Germán [00:00:53]:
We'll have her in the future. Thankfully, Bea Jackson is available. New York Times bestselling illustrator excuse me? And Bea encapsulates a moment in time with her work. Even as you look, as you look at some of these beautiful illustrations, you just notice how much it pops. I'm not an illustrator, so I probably not even using the right language, but that's. That's how I could describe what I see. The illustrations just stand out. They pop.
Roberto Germán [00:01:34]:
And b challenges herself to combine boundless imagination with experiences and emotion and capture the result on paper. A lifelong collector of both picture books and comics, she admires art's ability to speak perfectly on its own and translate ideas without words. The digital painter. Using textures that mimic pastels, oil paints, and watercolors, she pursues the rainbow in her palette, seeking to add touch of childhood magic to her work. Thank you, Bea, for being here, and I'm looking forward to learning from you to talking a little bit about summer is here, but really understanding your process, understanding your vision, understanding how it is that you make an impact through your work as an illustrator. So welcome to Our Classroom.
Bea Jackson [00:02:28]:
Thank you for having me.
Roberto Germán [00:02:30]:
My pleasure. My pleasure. And this lovely book, summer is here. Wow. It really resonates with me because when I look at the characters, they remind me of my children. They remind me of other children in my life, family members, friends, kids in the neighborhood. And so I think you just did a wonderful job of taking Renée's words and building on this notion of summer and connecting with summer, which is my favorite season, for sure. For sure.
Roberto Germán [00:03:07]:
And I live in Florida, so it feels like summer most of the year here. So beautiful work that you did with this book. And I would love for you to share what words you would use to describe your body of work across your books, including summers here.
Bea Jackson [00:03:27]:
Okay. Well, I love to explore themes of friendship, family, genuine connections, and just a lot of times when I do my artwork, I have to reach into my own memories. And if the memories aren't mine, I ask the author, like, what their visions are, so I can translate it to the page. So at the core, the illustration is about communication. Either it's communicating my ideas or the voice of the authors that I do artwork for.
Roberto Germán [00:04:01]:
And I guess I'm thinking, trying to put myself in your shoes as an illustrator. But I'm also thinking about my daughter, who loves to draw. What advice would you offer a young illustrator? And my daughter, my oldest daughter is nine years old. What advice would you offer a young illustrator in terms of how to use illustrations to effect effectively communicate?
Bea Jackson [00:04:31]:
Well, you have to be willing to think outside the box. I think sometimes when it comes to illustration, a lot of artists can be really hard on themselves, or, like, they might not think that they're as good as someone else, or they might struggle in different ways. And in my experiences, I've had to quiet a lot of that noise and just allow myself to have fun with the experience. You always have to keep in mind why it is that you love to draw and that keeps you at the core of, like, what's important to you. And the secondary side of it is the communication side, because if you're not in the right head space, it might be difficult to reach that point. So I think that you have to have a peace of mind about what you do with joy, about what you do, whether it's telling your stories or walking in other people's shoes through the other authors stories. And just remember that the message is the most important thing, not so much the technique and, like, all the different skills, because you can have a beautiful image that doesn't communicate anything, whereas you can have something that might be a little less polished, that communicates a world of stories to a lot of people. So at the core of it, continue to have fun with drawing.
Bea Jackson [00:05:53]:
Remember why you love it. Don't let all the training or the, you know, the, all the technical things of it ruin it, ruin the fun of it, and keep the message at the forefront.
Roberto Germán [00:06:05]:
So why do you love drawing? Why do you love being an illustrator?
Bea Jackson [00:06:11]:
Well, it's always been an opportunity for me to dive into my imagination. Like, I have a very vivid imagination. And, like, honestly, from, I would say from before the age of ten, it's hard for me to distinguish what was real and what wasn't because my imagination was just so vivid and I spent a lot of time alone. I was raised in a single mother household, so it was just me and my. Me and my thoughts, me and the piece of paper that's in front of me or whatever movies I watch. So I would just get lost in my own world. And I was so excited about it. Everything was so vivid, I wanted to draw it.
Bea Jackson [00:06:51]:
And it started with movies I would watch. I think one movie that I remember vividly watching is starship troopers. And I was like, it'd be really cool to see, like, an alien goddess on the planet that they got to encounter. Instead, they just encountered a lot of nasty bugs. But, you know, but that little simple thing of wanting to see something different inspired me to draw. It inspired me to write. And I would do all these stories and build all these characters up. And I have, like, stacks of folders of old drawings from, you know, me just exploring these ideas.
Bea Jackson [00:07:26]:
So I would say what I love most about drawing is the escape that it gives me to be able to just kind of sink into my own mind and that wonderful world that goes on in there. It's chaotic, but it's fun.
Roberto Germán [00:07:41]:
That's great. That's great, but let's push that. Let's go a little bit deeper. Can you continue to bring us through your creative process? What does that look like for you now when you're working on a new project? We know you have a lot going on. We understand that. But bring us into your world. Give us a glimpse of how it is that B. Jackson brings about these amazing illustrations.
Bea Jackson [00:08:09]:
Well, I just, I think, like, when I was younger, I looked up to a lot of different artists, so I am self taught. So I would take, like, a lot of different avenues to approaching illustration. Like the, the vision in my mind is usually very strong. Getting it onto the paper is another story. And sometimes the, as I mentioned, the technical side of things will get in the way of me just getting the, getting my vision onto the canvas. So after so many years of that and kind of being hard on myself in that way, I just decided to just start throwing things on the canvas and seeing what comes out. It just removed all of the rules and steps and everything that can lead up to an illustration. And so it's just, I'll start with a splotch of color.
Bea Jackson [00:08:58]:
Sometimes, like when I do my sketches, they're, they're really rough, but the message is there, so it'll be a splotch of color, and then I'll just start to refine it over time. Whereas some artists, they'll do the line art first, and then they'll fill in with colors. My process is pretty backwards. It allows me to just jump straight in. I jump straight into color. I jump straight into form and shapes and just fill it out as it goes. And that's what I find has found, has made the process a lot more enjoyable for me. And then you get a lot of textures and my artwork for that process where I'm not, like, polishing it out, trying to be too perfect with it.
Roberto Germán [00:09:40]:
So how does it work when you have a new project on your plate, for example, summer is here. Did you have distinct goals when you were working on summers here as opposed to some of your other works?
Bea Jackson [00:09:56]:
Well, the distinct goal with summers here is that it was a strong emphasis, emphasis on summer fun. So I just remembered what summer was like for me and tried to dig into that. Like, I had a lot of family reunions, and we would, like, I had. It was, I was part of a gang of neighborhood kids that would just run out, run around all day. We would swim and. And, like, have these different adventures and stuff. So I just tried to pull from those experiences. Experiences and combine those experiences with Renée's words to kind of emphasize, like, what it is.
Bea Jackson [00:10:34]:
Like, what summer. What summer what that summer experience has been. So that was my main goal there. And then also, like, in speaking with Renée, she did say that, like, summer itself is a character in the story. And I interpreted that as well through my artwork, and I tried to show it in the sun rays that would shine or, like, the wind, and I would use the flowers to kind of emphasize where summer is going. Like, if you'll see, if you look through the book, you might see petals flying around or especially towards the end, you see the petals falling off the flowers. It's kind of an indication of, like, summer being, like, a soft breeze. This is here for a moment, and then it starts to slip away to make room for the next season.
Bea Jackson [00:11:23]:
So those are different things that I tried to keep communicate and just really pay attention to what the words we're trying to convey and bringing it into a visual form.
Roberto Germán [00:11:35]:
That's great. And you mentioned that you're self taught. I'm wondering if you have any influences in terms of illustrators past and present, and if not just influences in general, that really helped to inspire some of your work.
Bea Jackson [00:11:57]:
Yes. So the digital painting aspect of my work came about because I got, when I first got the Internet, I got exposed to comic books and anime. So I just was, it was one artist in particular. His name was Michael Turner, and he had a series of comics called Fathom. And I really loved his artwork. He was also self taught artist, and he wasn't really, I guess at the time, widely accepted in the comic industry, so he formed his own set of comics. So I really, I really admired him, and I was like, well, in order for me to learn from him, I have to figure out how he does his work. So I found out that the comics were colored digitally, so I was like, okay, I have to do it digitally, you know, if I'm going to be like him, because my dream was to work with his comics one day.
Bea Jackson [00:12:52]:
And so I started off with Ms paint and a mouse, and then I upgraded to, like, old versions of Adobe. So I was actually doing digital paint painting digitally before it was widely accepted. And even some cases, it wasn't considered real art at the time because it wasn't physical. So I ran into that a lot. My father is also an artist. He inspired some of my work as well. He taught me how to draw my first eye. He would, like, walk me through different steps, and he does airbrush art, but he's able to, he's also able to kind of bring his visions from his mind onto the canvas, and, but those were my two earlier inspirators, people who inspired me in my artwork.
Bea Jackson [00:13:46]:
Unfortunately, I never got to meet Michael Turner. He passed away, so I never got to see that dream. But, you know, he inspired me to create. He's the one that made me decide I wanted to be an artist full time. And I went to college, and that's when I actually had some formal training, in which case I learned about some other artists, because for most of my life, I was just in a bubble. It was just me at home by myself with a bunch of line paper, printer paper drawing. So I didn't know, like, classical artists, I didn't know. I only knew what I could figure out on the Internet.
Bea Jackson [00:14:25]:
And even then, it was kind of hard, like, using dial up to find these things. So when I went to college, I got, I learned about Norman Rockwell, and I was very fascinated by his work because he would capture moments in time through his illustrations. He was also very different in his day because the form of art that was more accepted was more posed. And I guess I can't remember specifically what things were going, but I know he stood out in his time or, like, his ability to just capture moments in time. He didn't want to create, like, these perfect images where, you know, everybody looks, you know, perfect. So he would show kids running or making goofy faces or just, it's like somebody just snapped a picture. So I tried to incorporate that into my artwork, and, and the other figure that really stands out to me. And this is the last one.
Bea Jackson [00:15:27]:
I mean, there's others, but these are like, the big. The big ones is Kadir Nelson. I love his artwork. I love the way that he illustrates black characters. Black skin. Black skin can be very difficult to paint because there's so many shades and tones that you don't consider that it's harder to get it to come out through the painting process. Have to sprinkle in the rainbow in the skin, because our black skin is also very reflective. So learning from him, I learned how to.
Bea Jackson [00:16:07]:
How to paint black skin a lot better. And I love his themes. I love his books. I have a lot of his books. I even will collect some national geographic, Indian National Geographic magazines because he had. His artwork was on it. So those are my main influences and how they each affected me in different ways.
Roberto Germán [00:16:28]:
So fascinating to hear and gather perspectives of an illustrator and how it is that your work is informed even as you're talking about. I'm like, yeah, I probably would have never considered this or would have framed the words to describe black skin as you just did.
Bea Jackson [00:16:49]:
Right.
Roberto Germán [00:16:49]:
You know, the rainbow and it being reflective. So it's helpful for me to learn and get into your mind and understand how illustrators see things and describe things. And I'm interested about how your father views your work, given that he's one of the individuals that inspired your work through his own work and painting. And so how does he engage with your work? How has he viewed your work? What type of feedback has he offered you?
Bea Jackson [00:17:21]:
Well, he's just. He's very proud right now.
Roberto Germán [00:17:26]:
He absolutely should be.
Bea Jackson [00:17:27]:
Yeah. So he. He doesn't offer much, much feedback because me and me and my father, we work in very different ways. Like, I'm exclusively digital. He's exclusively traditional. So he loves to make, like, cutouts and spray paint them. And he does, like, body paint and things like that. So we both respect each other in our different fields.
Bea Jackson [00:17:51]:
We probably couldn't step into each other's shoes in that regard. So we're trying to, like, we're trying to kind of come to the middle. So he really wants to do something where we're Jackson and Jackson, like, father and daughter team, where we combine our different skill sets. So I could help bring his artwork into a more digital format, like, to maybe cut into, like, a print market or like, other types of markets, where he can take my artwork into more of a physical format, where we can combine ideas and stuff. So that's something that we're looking to explore. We're both in different stages in our career where we kind of have a bit more flexibility to do that. So I don't know how it's gonna go, but, like, he's a wonderful man. I respect him a lot.
Bea Jackson [00:18:46]:
And, you know, I just want to, like, I would like to see how that turns out. Like, if you do get to do a Jackson and Jackson team up.
Roberto Germán [00:18:55]:
Yes. Jackson and Jackson art. I love it. I love it. I wish I knew how to draw and illustrate. I'd do something with my daughter, but she's just gonna have to illustrate a book that I write. Yeah, you mentioned the phrase moment in time. Is there something that.
Roberto Germán [00:19:24]:
Let me reframe this. If you had the opportunity to do so, and I know you have different projects going on, but if you could just stop all your projects and you'd be like, you know what? I have this time. I'm going to do this. I'm going to this. I'm going to capture this moment in time, what would it be? What's the thing that you would capture right now?
Bea Jackson [00:19:44]:
Well, one thing that I. That I. Well, I love fantasy, so there's always a magical element to it. But one thing that I've been wanting to do, and this. This is just, like, something more casual, I've. I've been really pushing myself to meet new people, like, having new experiences and stuff, because I'm a very introverted person by nature, and in order to kind of break out of that, I have to kind of put myself in spaces where I have to be more extroverted. And it can be, you know, painful and also rewarding at the same time because I wouldn't meet so many wonderful people if I did not step outside of my comfort zone. So, like, I would love the moments that I would like to capture is meeting these different people.
Bea Jackson [00:20:32]:
So I wanted to do, like, little portraitures of different people I meet, and not everybody I meet, I talk to. I might run into somebody on the street, and I'm like, oh, your outfit's cool. And I was like, can I take a picture of it so I could draw it later? And some people are very open to that. So I have a few pictures of just random people that I've met that just, you know, struck a chord with me in different ways. And I would like to immortalize that through, like, doing these different portraitures so that, like, however many years down the line, I have this tapestry of all these faces of people that I've met and the stories that, you know, I have from those experiences, just, like, taking that moment and remembering it forever like a photograph. It's just locked in my memory right now, so. And in my phone.
Roberto Germán [00:21:21]:
Thanks for sharing. Thanks for sharing. So, what. What, um, you. You've mentioned unifying themes in your books. Can you share a memorable reaction or feedback from a child to parent that rein reaffirmed the impact of your work?
Bea Jackson [00:21:44]:
Yes. I would say the. The most notable experience was it wasn't in the book format. It was actually in the series that I did for Target Wonder shop, where I got to do, I got to design some Christmas decorations. And when I first got that opportunity, I was like, I've never done any work like this in terms of, you know, having it be on the shelf and in the form of gift wraps or anything like that. So I was like, I really don't know what to do. But I asked him if I could, you know, just create a character and, you know, tell a little story through that character through, like, four illustrations. And then different elements in those different illustrations could be used for other things to kind of build the theme up, build up the collection.
Bea Jackson [00:22:35]:
So I created this little girl that was inspired by my childhood Christmas experiences. She. Curly hair and freckles, and there's one image where she's, like, wanting to steal the cookies and the cakes off the table that were made for Christmas is another where she's bundled up in scarves that her grandmother made. So when I first did that series, there was a little bit of back and forth because it was like, we usually don't see stuff like that in a store or, like, I have. So, you know, you usually just see, like, the regular Santa Claus or you might not see characters that, you know, that have our skin tone or black. So I was like, it would be really cool if, you know, I could go into the store and see something like this. So I was given the creative freedom to do that, and which I am extremely grateful for because it took me outside of the box. I like, I like, I love to have that creative freedom and that same need that I felt to kind of have that type of imagery in the store was resonated with very strongly when it actually hit the shelves, it became a collector's item for a lot of people, and I've had so many people sending me pictures of their little girls, like, is that me on the box? And I was like, it did its job, you know?
Roberto Germán [00:23:58]:
That's right.
Bea Jackson [00:23:59]:
I want people to go into the store and see themselves or, like, see their daughter. You know, I wish I could have did more characters. I just didn't have. I just didn't have the room to do it, but I had a lot of people share that experience that it was just like a stop in their tracks wow moment. Is that me? You know, so that just made it all the more rewarding and made me have more trust in my own ideas and. And the direction I wanted to take with it that it was a good one, even though it felt risky at the time.
Roberto Germán [00:24:33]:
Do you go out there and seek certain projects based on themes you want to explore? Is it, you know, you just kind of vet them as they come your way? If it suits you, then wonderful. How does that work?
Bea Jackson [00:24:49]:
I more so vet things as they come my way. Like, I might meet people and they'll share their ideas. I mainly want to stick with themes that I can, that promote connectivity, connection with people. Because in my mind, the world is really dark in a lot of different ways, and it's easy to show that darkness or kind of fall into it. And I would rather show the things that people have in common that bring them together than the things that separate us. And so that's why I really like to focus on family, good family moments. There's a lot of people that have traumas because their family structure just wasn't great. And I want to tell a story that family can be in your friends, it can be in other connections that you have, because I've had those experiences.
Bea Jackson [00:25:46]:
So I try to focus on. On those things in the positive and connect with people in those different ways to show healthy dynamics. And even if it's not a healthy dynamic, I try to show ways to kind of navigate around things depending on the book that it is that I'm working on. I just try to keep a lot of things like that into consideration in terms of the storytelling. And I also like doing historical books, especially if it's somebody that I don't know about, because it's educational for me as well.
Roberto Germán [00:26:20]:
Like, absolutely.
Bea Jackson [00:26:21]:
If I'm to communicate another person's story, it's kind of like going into a movie blind. You know, you really don't know what you're going to get. But if the experience is fresh for me, I could also make it fresh for other people that are reading it because I have to expose myself to this, you know, this information. It helps me to tell the story better. It helps me. It helps my curiosity to know more about this different person. And it's a learning experience. It makes.
Bea Jackson [00:26:50]:
It makes my job a lot harder, but, you know, it's a learning experience, and then I can tell that story.
Roberto Germán [00:26:56]:
To other people does when you say it makes your job a lot harder, you mean because you have to go about the process a little bit differently? You need to look at photos of the individuals, things of the sort of.
Bea Jackson [00:27:09]:
Yes. So it's harder in that I'm not relying solely on my imagination to get the image across. There's a lot of respect and care that you have to apply towards biographical pieces that are more biographical. So I might have. So I had to do well, I did the book for Bayard Rustin. Unstoppable. I had never heard of him before. I didn't know his role in the civil rights movement, but he was relegated to the background, even though he was a major player in planning the march on Washington, he was relegated to the background because he was openly gay black men.
Bea Jackson [00:27:54]:
So they didn't want his image to kind of ruin the movement, so he had to take a backseat. So we're just now learning about him. So there aren't a lot of pictures of him. Most of the pictures that I am able to find of him were in black and white, and a lot of the settings, the flyers that were around at that time, I don't know what any of those things look like. So I have to do, like, a lot of research to kind of, like, fill in the gaps. Like, what was his actual skin tone like? Was he dark skinned or was he light skinned? Cause I don't know. What does he look like when he smiles? What does he look like when he's upset? Like, all these different things. Like, we live in a very digital age where we can see a person's face every which way, 3d maps, all the different expressions and stuff like that.
Bea Jackson [00:28:50]:
So just trying to capture that emotion, it can be a lot harder if you don't know what the person looks like in different states. And the colors, like, a lot of the pictures back then, even though they were taken in color, they were printed in black and white, so we only see the black and white versions. So it's like, what did the colors look like back then? Like, if you look at the stuff from, like, the nineties, everything is vibrant. Hot pinks and stuff like that, whereas the seventies is more saturated. Browns and golds. So it's like, what did it look like in the fifties? You know, what could they print? What. What colors could they use? So those are all things that come to mind when I'm trying to step back into that moment in time with limited information.
Roberto Germán [00:29:34]:
That's good. That's good. Yeah. The nineties was characterized by cross colors.
Bea Jackson [00:29:41]:
Very fun time.
Roberto Germán [00:29:42]:
Oh, yes. Oh, yes. If you had the opportunity to have lunch with anybody that are alive, who would it be and why?
Bea Jackson [00:29:53]:
I would probably have lunch with Vashti Harrison. She's another children's book artist that I greatly respect. I look up to her and the stories that she tells, and we had a moment a few years ago when we were both at the BET children's books awards, so we were both, like, nominees and stuff. But, like, I. So I had a brief moment to see her and talk to her. So I was like, I would love to have that opportunity again, just, you know, reconnect and learn from her. So, like, she's, you know, she's in such a wonderful place in her career, and I feel like I'm still learning. I'm still growing in a lot of different ways.
Bea Jackson [00:30:34]:
So, you know, that that will be a really cool experience to kind of have that time.
Roberto Germán [00:30:41]:
What's a message of encouragement that you would like to offer the audience?
Bea Jackson [00:30:48]:
Whatever you like to do, be it to sing or write or draw, you know, just stay connected with what. What made you love it in the first place, no matter what it is. So, like, I talk to a lot of artists. You know, from our perspective, things can get a little hard. Like, life can kind of suck the creativity out of you. You know, we could also be really hard on ourselves. And, you know, the Internet is a ruthless place, so it doesn't.
Roberto Germán [00:31:22]:
Ain't that the truth?
Bea Jackson [00:31:22]:
It doesn't make it easy, you know, but at the end of the day, do what you do because you love to do it. If you want to tell a story, there's nothing stopping you from telling it. You just might have to do a little bit of extra work to get it out there, but just stay connected to what you love, the heart of what it is that you do. Because even with my job or the work that I do, if I don't keep that connection there, I think we're to resent something that I've enjoyed my whole life. And sometimes that means I have to give myself time to just draw something silly or just not work related or, you know, just kind of step back into that childhood wonder. At least that's what it is for me. So I say stay creative. Stay loving it.
Bea Jackson [00:32:09]:
Like, being creative.
Roberto Germán [00:32:12]:
Thank you. For folks that want to learn more about your work, about you, what's the best. You mentioned connectivity. So what's the best place to connect with you?
Bea Jackson [00:32:25]:
The best place to connect with me is on Instagram, which I believe my Instagram is be gifted. So I have the same handle across everything. Be gifted. That's b e a gifted. G I f t e d. So that makes it easier to find me. You also may find me listed as Brittany Jackson. That's my real name.
Bea Jackson [00:32:53]:
So. But I changed it because, you know, I wanted a name that has meaning to it and be means blessed. And I wanted to, you know, use my work as a blessing onto others and to use my gifts to bless others to help tell their stories. And so I changed it.
Roberto Germán [00:33:12]:
I love it.
Bea Jackson [00:33:13]:
So if you put in be gifted, you'll find me. Best way to connect with me is Instagram.
Roberto Germán [00:33:18]:
Amen. Amen. Bless Jackson, folks. Bless Jackson. Listen, you can find summers here across all the different outlets, Amazon and other bookstores published by Bloomsbury. Again, this is a beautiful, beautiful book. So encourage you all to check it out, grab a copy, get it in the classrooms, read it in the libraries. This book definitely deserves to be amplified and it's doing great.
Roberto Germán [00:33:54]:
But let's, let's continue to push it. So thank you Bea for your time. Thank you for being here. Thank you for sharing. We appreciate your insight. Look forward to learning more about your work and seeing wonderful projects coming our way, whether through the form of books or in target or in other places where we can see ourselves reflected. Thank you for reflecting us in your illustrations.
Bea Jackson [00:34:22]:
Thank you. It's my pleasure to be here and thank you for the interview.
Roberto Germán [00:34:26]:
Alright, take care. As always, your engagement in Our Classroom is greatly appreciated. Be sure to subscribe, rate the show, and write a review. Finally, for resources to help you understand the intersection of race, bias, education and society, go to multiculturalclassroom.com. peace and love from your host Roberto Germán.
